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	<title>Comments on: Who would have thought, hey?</title>
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		<title>By: Domhuaille MacMathghamhna</title>
		<link>http://worldofarsenal.co.uk/2012/04/26/who-would-have-thought-hey/#comment-56742</link>
		<dc:creator>Domhuaille MacMathghamhna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Apr 2012 02:40:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://worldofarsenal.co.uk/?p=5427#comment-56742</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Gareth.....why do you think Wenger has been ¨undone¨? He is, alongaside SAF and Mourinho considered by anyone who knows professional football, including EUFA and FIFA, to be the manager of the decade. You compare him to many great managers but it is impossible to fairly judge him against those men as he never managed when they were dominant. Arguably one of the greats,SAF is the only currently active manager who we can compare him to and SAF has had the resources and the support, some say from the FA,the EPL and the referees to achieve while AW supposedly hasn&#039;t. None of the famous men you name had to arrange their teams with a limited budget because they were building a new stadium and the Board wanted a cut price team, which Aw provided. None of them had an unbeaten EPL season, nor have they developed so many talents and discovered so many future stars as he has.
I know you&#039;re a member of the AAA and Wenger-out brigade but in all fairness, your blinkered prejudice against Wenger is based on your version of ¨success¨ and your spurious comparisons to legends, who I am very sure would appreciate what Aw has achieved far more fairly and intelligently than you.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gareth&#8230;..why do you think Wenger has been ¨undone¨? He is, alongaside SAF and Mourinho considered by anyone who knows professional football, including EUFA and FIFA, to be the manager of the decade. You compare him to many great managers but it is impossible to fairly judge him against those men as he never managed when they were dominant. Arguably one of the greats,SAF is the only currently active manager who we can compare him to and SAF has had the resources and the support, some say from the FA,the EPL and the referees to achieve while AW supposedly hasn&#8217;t. None of the famous men you name had to arrange their teams with a limited budget because they were building a new stadium and the Board wanted a cut price team, which Aw provided. None of them had an unbeaten EPL season, nor have they developed so many talents and discovered so many future stars as he has.<br />
I know you&#8217;re a member of the AAA and Wenger-out brigade but in all fairness, your blinkered prejudice against Wenger is based on your version of ¨success¨ and your spurious comparisons to legends, who I am very sure would appreciate what Aw has achieved far more fairly and intelligently than you.</p>
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		<title>By: gareth</title>
		<link>http://worldofarsenal.co.uk/2012/04/26/who-would-have-thought-hey/#comment-56734</link>
		<dc:creator>gareth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Apr 2012 21:09:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://worldofarsenal.co.uk/?p=5427#comment-56734</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I think Wenger’s unflinching faith towards players who have let him down at times has also been his undoing. Philippe Senderos was mauled by Drogba in two Chelsea v Arsenal encounters in August, 2005. From then on, with Senderos it was inconsistency. The penny finally dropped on Wenger after Senderos endured a torrid time against Liverpool in a European Cup encounter at Anfield in April, 2008. Some of the greatest managers know when to move players on, even if they are great players. When Bob Paisley (more on him later) masterminded Liverpool’s first European Cup win in Rome against German champions Borussia Mönchengladbach in 1977, two of the players he started with that night were long-time Anfield stalwarts, Ian Callaghan, Liverpool’s record appearance-holder, and one-time title-winning skipper, Tommy Smith, scorer of Liverpool’s second goal that night in 3-1 win. But when they retained the trophy a year later against Belgian club FC Bruges at Wembley, Messrs Callaghan and Smith were replaced with Graeme Souness and Alan Hansen, both of whom would go on to forge successful Liverpool careers themselves, especially as captains. Sir Alex Ferguson has never shown sentiment to any of his players too, no matter how great they were. Just ask the likes of McGrath, Ince, Beckham and even Roy Keane.

Trophy-wise and to his credit, Wenger has been successful. But, compared to the truly great managers, not as successful. Certainly his failure so far to win a UEFA trophy is a horrible black mark on his career, and the fact that he is the only manager to have lost all three UEFA finals is a stain he doesn’t deserve. Would you really put Wenger in the same bracket as European Cup-winning managers such as Ferguson, Paisley, Clough, Stein et al? Some great managers have gone lengthy periods without trophies, but there are valid reasons for this. At Liverpool, Bill Shankly didn’t see any trophies at all for seven years between the title-win of 1966 and the title (at our expense) and UEFA Cup double of 1973. But this was because of his rebuilding process. A shock FA Cup Third Round exit at the hands of Second Division Watford in 1970 prompted Shankly belatedly to break up his great 1960s side. His assistant at the time, Bob Paisley, thought it should have been done two years earlier.

Sir Matt Busby and Brian Clough had similar droughts too, though with Busby he could be excused. So far, Wenger is seven years and counting without a trophy, not for the want of trying (sometimes). It’s the Arsenal’s longest lean spell without silverware since 1979-87 and is the longest that any manager of the club has overseen. And there have been too many excuses to boot. Injuries, bad refereeing-decisions, petro-dollar-filled clubs to name but a few. The 2007/08 Premier League title was ours for the taking but a poor reaction to Eduardo’s injury saw that challenge collapse. And what excuses were there for losing the 2011 League Cup final to relegation-fodder Birmingham City? Wenger’s apologists would argue that he is overseeing a transitional period. But do they really last at least five years? One reason for his constant rebuilding of ‘new’ teams is that he constantly loses players for a variety of reasons. Some of them some lose faith in him. And could you blame them? The truly great managers successfully evolve one great team to another.

Wenger’s defenders will claim the Double triumphs, the unbeaten title and consistently finishing in the top four make him a great manager. Greater than Brian Clough, who took not one but two medium-sized East Midlands clubs from Second Division obscurity to English champions and, in the case of Nottingham Forest, back-to-back European champions? Or Sir Matt Busby, who in the ten years after losing half of a great team to an aviation disaster in 1958, won the FA Cup, two First Division titles and, ultimately, the European Cup on English soil with three of the world’s greatest-ever players in Best, Law and Charlton? What about Sir Alex Ferguson’s achievements at Aberdeen? He ruled his own homeland, landed the European Cup-Winners Cup against Real Madrid and put the frighteners on the Old Firm, especially former club Rangers.

My favourite manager ever is Bob Paisley. Criminally never knighted, in nine seasons as Liverpool manager between 1974-83, Paisley could point to six league titles (three times back-to-back) and three European Cups, including back-to-back triumphs in 1977 and 1978, in an era when to be champions of Europe, you HAD to win your league, and when European draws were random, unlike the seeding and country-protection you get today. Wenger’s consistent ability to finish in the top four would look better if there were a couple of trophies along the way. Finishing second, third or fourth to qualify for the European Cup should never ever be recognised as a ‘trophy’. Wenger’s European Cup record is not as great as some would make out either. True, he has reached a final and another semi-final (in which we completely embarrassed ourselves). However, in fourteen consecutive seasons of European Cup football, Wenger has overseen four group-stage exits (one of which led to a UEFA Cup final defeat to Galatasaray, the only Turkish club to have won a UEFA trophy) and has been knocked out of the round of sixteen four times. Not exactly the hallmark of greatness here.

Arsène Wenger can still achieve true greatness if he learns to adapt and evolve. If recent history has taught us anything, he is reluctant to do this. Personally I don’t think he will, because he is too stubborn in his ways, but I hope I’m wrong. Failure to do this could lead to a few regrets, and those who are critical of him would make their opinions known with greater aggression. Certainly, Wenger’s overall managerial record makes a mockery of media darlings such as Allardyce, Pulis and especially Redknapp, who between them have won one major trophy and have finished no higher than fourth in the top flight. Up The Arsenal!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think Wenger’s unflinching faith towards players who have let him down at times has also been his undoing. Philippe Senderos was mauled by Drogba in two Chelsea v Arsenal encounters in August, 2005. From then on, with Senderos it was inconsistency. The penny finally dropped on Wenger after Senderos endured a torrid time against Liverpool in a European Cup encounter at Anfield in April, 2008. Some of the greatest managers know when to move players on, even if they are great players. When Bob Paisley (more on him later) masterminded Liverpool’s first European Cup win in Rome against German champions Borussia Mönchengladbach in 1977, two of the players he started with that night were long-time Anfield stalwarts, Ian Callaghan, Liverpool’s record appearance-holder, and one-time title-winning skipper, Tommy Smith, scorer of Liverpool’s second goal that night in 3-1 win. But when they retained the trophy a year later against Belgian club FC Bruges at Wembley, Messrs Callaghan and Smith were replaced with Graeme Souness and Alan Hansen, both of whom would go on to forge successful Liverpool careers themselves, especially as captains. Sir Alex Ferguson has never shown sentiment to any of his players too, no matter how great they were. Just ask the likes of McGrath, Ince, Beckham and even Roy Keane.</p>
<p>Trophy-wise and to his credit, Wenger has been successful. But, compared to the truly great managers, not as successful. Certainly his failure so far to win a UEFA trophy is a horrible black mark on his career, and the fact that he is the only manager to have lost all three UEFA finals is a stain he doesn’t deserve. Would you really put Wenger in the same bracket as European Cup-winning managers such as Ferguson, Paisley, Clough, Stein et al? Some great managers have gone lengthy periods without trophies, but there are valid reasons for this. At Liverpool, Bill Shankly didn’t see any trophies at all for seven years between the title-win of 1966 and the title (at our expense) and UEFA Cup double of 1973. But this was because of his rebuilding process. A shock FA Cup Third Round exit at the hands of Second Division Watford in 1970 prompted Shankly belatedly to break up his great 1960s side. His assistant at the time, Bob Paisley, thought it should have been done two years earlier.</p>
<p>Sir Matt Busby and Brian Clough had similar droughts too, though with Busby he could be excused. So far, Wenger is seven years and counting without a trophy, not for the want of trying (sometimes). It’s the Arsenal’s longest lean spell without silverware since 1979-87 and is the longest that any manager of the club has overseen. And there have been too many excuses to boot. Injuries, bad refereeing-decisions, petro-dollar-filled clubs to name but a few. The 2007/08 Premier League title was ours for the taking but a poor reaction to Eduardo’s injury saw that challenge collapse. And what excuses were there for losing the 2011 League Cup final to relegation-fodder Birmingham City? Wenger’s apologists would argue that he is overseeing a transitional period. But do they really last at least five years? One reason for his constant rebuilding of ‘new’ teams is that he constantly loses players for a variety of reasons. Some of them some lose faith in him. And could you blame them? The truly great managers successfully evolve one great team to another.</p>
<p>Wenger’s defenders will claim the Double triumphs, the unbeaten title and consistently finishing in the top four make him a great manager. Greater than Brian Clough, who took not one but two medium-sized East Midlands clubs from Second Division obscurity to English champions and, in the case of Nottingham Forest, back-to-back European champions? Or Sir Matt Busby, who in the ten years after losing half of a great team to an aviation disaster in 1958, won the FA Cup, two First Division titles and, ultimately, the European Cup on English soil with three of the world’s greatest-ever players in Best, Law and Charlton? What about Sir Alex Ferguson’s achievements at Aberdeen? He ruled his own homeland, landed the European Cup-Winners Cup against Real Madrid and put the frighteners on the Old Firm, especially former club Rangers.</p>
<p>My favourite manager ever is Bob Paisley. Criminally never knighted, in nine seasons as Liverpool manager between 1974-83, Paisley could point to six league titles (three times back-to-back) and three European Cups, including back-to-back triumphs in 1977 and 1978, in an era when to be champions of Europe, you HAD to win your league, and when European draws were random, unlike the seeding and country-protection you get today. Wenger’s consistent ability to finish in the top four would look better if there were a couple of trophies along the way. Finishing second, third or fourth to qualify for the European Cup should never ever be recognised as a ‘trophy’. Wenger’s European Cup record is not as great as some would make out either. True, he has reached a final and another semi-final (in which we completely embarrassed ourselves). However, in fourteen consecutive seasons of European Cup football, Wenger has overseen four group-stage exits (one of which led to a UEFA Cup final defeat to Galatasaray, the only Turkish club to have won a UEFA trophy) and has been knocked out of the round of sixteen four times. Not exactly the hallmark of greatness here.</p>
<p>Arsène Wenger can still achieve true greatness if he learns to adapt and evolve. If recent history has taught us anything, he is reluctant to do this. Personally I don’t think he will, because he is too stubborn in his ways, but I hope I’m wrong. Failure to do this could lead to a few regrets, and those who are critical of him would make their opinions known with greater aggression. Certainly, Wenger’s overall managerial record makes a mockery of media darlings such as Allardyce, Pulis and especially Redknapp, who between them have won one major trophy and have finished no higher than fourth in the top flight. Up The Arsenal!</p>
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		<title>By: Rohan Leslie</title>
		<link>http://worldofarsenal.co.uk/2012/04/26/who-would-have-thought-hey/#comment-56700</link>
		<dc:creator>Rohan Leslie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Apr 2012 08:39:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://worldofarsenal.co.uk/?p=5427#comment-56700</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Looks like Podolski&#039;s in the bag. If we could add M&#039;vila, Yanga-Mbiwa and one of either Gotze or Hazard, I reckon we&#039;d have a good chance of competing for the title. We&#039;ve got the money allegedly- let&#039;s see if Wenger will spend this time- surely he must!!!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Looks like Podolski&#8217;s in the bag. If we could add M&#8217;vila, Yanga-Mbiwa and one of either Gotze or Hazard, I reckon we&#8217;d have a good chance of competing for the title. We&#8217;ve got the money allegedly- let&#8217;s see if Wenger will spend this time- surely he must!!!</p>
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		<title>By: ChrisC</title>
		<link>http://worldofarsenal.co.uk/2012/04/26/who-would-have-thought-hey/#comment-56699</link>
		<dc:creator>ChrisC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Apr 2012 08:21:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://worldofarsenal.co.uk/?p=5427#comment-56699</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Yes...AND Arsenal could still finish 4th which means it is vital that Chelsea are beaten otherwise they will be there next season and we wont! Makes finishing 3rd more important than just finishing ahead of Tottenham!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes&#8230;AND Arsenal could still finish 4th which means it is vital that Chelsea are beaten otherwise they will be there next season and we wont! Makes finishing 3rd more important than just finishing ahead of Tottenham!</p>
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		<title>By: Domhuaille MacMathghamhna</title>
		<link>http://worldofarsenal.co.uk/2012/04/26/who-would-have-thought-hey/#comment-56687</link>
		<dc:creator>Domhuaille MacMathghamhna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Apr 2012 01:14:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://worldofarsenal.co.uk/?p=5427#comment-56687</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[you are too pessimistic about our players Devday.....Wilshere is the new great hope for England,Kos is Vermaelen&#039;s best partner, OAC  is the most dynamic midfielder/striker we&#039;ve seen in ages, Ryo will slot into the team and terrorize defenses, Arteta is in a class of his own, Rosicky is a man this season, Sagna is a rock and Song is one of the best holding midfielders in the EPL when he decides to do his job, Szcesny is the heart of the team&#039;s defense and RVP is the King of the EPL so maybe lauding Chelsea and Bayern is worthwhile but not at the expense of praising our excellent squad.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>you are too pessimistic about our players Devday&#8230;..Wilshere is the new great hope for England,Kos is Vermaelen&#8217;s best partner, OAC  is the most dynamic midfielder/striker we&#8217;ve seen in ages, Ryo will slot into the team and terrorize defenses, Arteta is in a class of his own, Rosicky is a man this season, Sagna is a rock and Song is one of the best holding midfielders in the EPL when he decides to do his job, Szcesny is the heart of the team&#8217;s defense and RVP is the King of the EPL so maybe lauding Chelsea and Bayern is worthwhile but not at the expense of praising our excellent squad.</p>
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		<title>By: sazs</title>
		<link>http://worldofarsenal.co.uk/2012/04/26/who-would-have-thought-hey/#comment-56683</link>
		<dc:creator>sazs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Apr 2012 00:21:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://worldofarsenal.co.uk/?p=5427#comment-56683</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I disagree with you coz Vermalen has already got his partner. Kos has been good and will become better next season.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I disagree with you coz Vermalen has already got his partner. Kos has been good and will become better next season.</p>
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		<title>By: Greeze</title>
		<link>http://worldofarsenal.co.uk/2012/04/26/who-would-have-thought-hey/#comment-56679</link>
		<dc:creator>Greeze</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Apr 2012 23:19:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://worldofarsenal.co.uk/?p=5427#comment-56679</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I am glad that it&#039;s not Real Madrid vs Barcelona
I have watched too many of those this season and last
And to be honest, they&#039;ve lost their appeal.
Too much falling over, feigning injury and dirty tactics

Come on Bayern!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am glad that it&#8217;s not Real Madrid vs Barcelona<br />
I have watched too many of those this season and last<br />
And to be honest, they&#8217;ve lost their appeal.<br />
Too much falling over, feigning injury and dirty tactics</p>
<p>Come on Bayern!</p>
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